 OgopogoJoined: 11 Dec 2004 Total posts: 11616 Gender: Unknown
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 Posted: 01/ 06/ 06 11:50 pm Post subject: Benedict XVI on Islam and the West |
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http://hughhewitt.com/archives/2006/01/01-week/index.php#a000962
Benedict XVI on Islam and the West
by Hugh Hewitt
Yesterday I interviewd Father Jospeh Fessio, Provosty of Ave Maria University in Naples, Florida, and student and friend of Benedict XVI. (Father Fessio is also the founder of Ignatius Press.) The entire interview should be read, and the transcript is here, but the most fascinating part concerned a gathering at Castle Gandolfo with the Pope and his students this past September, where the subject was Islam:
HH: Oh, you bet. Yesterday wouldn't be too soon. Let's go back to this meeting, because I'm fascinated by this. And to the extent that you can, obviously, without violating confidence, who was there? And how did it unfold? And what was the idea behind it?
JF: Well, Joseph Ratzinger as professor was very, very popular, and had many, many graduate students. And as part of the graduate program, you'd have these seminars called Hauptseminare, major seminars, or Proseminaren, and there'd be eight or ten or twelve of us graduate students with Cardinal Ratzinger. Then, he was Father Ratzinger leading it. And they were so rich, so fruitful, that when he became archbishop of Munich in 1977, the students decided that they would want to try and continue some kind of regular meeting to discuss theological issues. And he was very happy to do that. So from that point on, every year, we have met for a weekend, usually at a monastery. We'll pray together, we'll read scripture together, we'll do fellowship together, we will study together, we will eat together, and have a couple of presentations from scholars on a particular topic, and we'll discuss it. They've always been very, very enriching and very beautiful. And so, we had planned last year, in 2004, that in 2005, we would discuss Islam. And it was all agreed upon. We had two people picked out to come. When he was elected Pope, we figured well, it's going to be all off now. But he said no, no. He said I'm Pope, but I want to keep my relationships with my friends in the past, and I want to continue this. That's why we had it again.
HH: And the other speaker, who would that have been?
JF: That was another Jesuit, actually, from Germany, a Father Christian Troll, who is an expert on Islam in Europe.
HH: And what were the natures of their presentations? That it is an ominous time for Christendom, because it simply cannot keep pace, either population or with zeal, compared to the reach of Islam?
JF: Let me divide my answer into two parts, and you can interrupt me at any time, because I realize it's your show. I'm taking all the time.
HH: Oh, no. I'm fascinated.
JF: But as background, I want to say without exaggeration, and without trying to become histrionic here, I see the trends...I've seen them for years, in Europe, of depopulation as you've mentioned. And their immigration is coming from the South, which is mainly Islamic. And there are, I think there are 98 Islamic countries in the world, and 97 of them do not have religious freedom. The only one that does is Mali, where Timbuktu is, you know. It's in a desert, so you can hardly count it. Sorry about any Malians who are listening to this program. And that's what's going to happen to Europe. Once there's an Islamic majority, it is going to not...it's going to eliminate religious freedom. However...and therefore, Western civilization as we know it. However, in the United States, we also are not having children. There's abortion. There's contraception. There's the ideal of a one or two child family. But where is our immigration coming from? From Ecuador, from Mexico, from Cuba, from Guatemala. And these people are Christians. And so, I believe without being...you know, having hubris as an American, I believe that Christians in the United States are the ones who will be able to save not just Christianity, but Western civilization, if we maintain our fidelity to the scriptures, our fidelity to Christ, our fidelity to family life, and our fidelity to fertility and fruitfulness in marriage. So I believe we are in a world historical century, which is going to depend upon the strength of Christianity in these United States. I say I think that's...I may raise my voice. I may get excited. I might waive a Bible or something like that, but I believe this is the hard facts, unless God...He could always...He's in charge. He could perform a miracle. He could do something we can't possibly have foreseen. But I see that as what's happening. Now, that's part one. The second part is shorter. The main presentation by this Father Troll was very interesting. He based it on a Pakistani Muslim scholar names Rashan, who was at the University of Chicago for many years, and Rashan's position was Islam can enter into dialogue with modernity, but only if it radically reinterprets the Koran, and takes the specific legislation of the Koran, like cutting off your hand if you're a thief, or being able to have four wives, or whatever, and takes the principles behind those specific pieces of legislation for the 7th Century of Arabia, and now applies them, and modifies them, for a new society which women are now respected for their full dignity, where democracy's important, religious freedom's important, and so on. And if Islam does that, then it will be able to enter into real dialogue and live together with other religions and other kinds of cultures.
HH: Is he an optimist about that happening?
JF: He is, but interesting, Hugh, you know, all the seminars I recall with Joseph Ratzinger, Father Ratzinger, he'd always let the students speak. He'd wait until the end, and he would intervene. This is the first time I recall where he made an immediate statement. And I'm still struck by it, how powerful it was.
HH: We only have thirty seconds, Father Fessio.
JF: Oh, I can't do it.
HH: Then I want to come back after the break.
JF: Okay. Hugh, we've got to come back to this after the break.
HH: That's the greatest bridge ever.
JF: That'll keep your listeners.
HH: You betcha. No one's going to go away. And here's what the Pope said...
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HH: Father Fessio, before the break, you were telling us that after the presentation at Castel Gandolfo by two scholars of Islam this summer with Benedict in attendance, as well as his former students, for the first time in your memory, the Pope did not allow his students to first comment and reserve comment, but in fact, went first. Why, and what did he say?
JF: Well, the thesis that was proposed by this scholar was that Islam can enter into the modern world if the Koran is reinterpreted by taking the specific legislation, and going back to the principles, and then adapting it to our times, especially with the dignity that we ascribe to women, which has come through Christianity, of course. And immediately, the Holy Father, in his beautiful calm but clear way, said well, there's a fundamental problem with that, because he said in the Islamic tradition, God has given His word to Mohammed, but it's an eternal word. It's not Mohammed's word. It's there for eternity the way it is. There's no possibility of adapting it or interpreting it, whereas in Christianity, and Judaism, the dynamism's completely different, that God has worked through His creatures. And so, it is not just the word of God, it's the word of Isaiah, not just the word of God, but the word of Mark. He's used His human creatures, and inspired them to speak His word to the world, and therefore by establishing a Church in which he gives authority to His followers to carry on the tradition and interpret it, there's an inner logic to the Christian Bible, which permits it and requires it to be adapted and applied to new situations. I was...I mean, Hugh, I wish I could say it as clearly and as beautifully as he did, but that's why he's Pope and I'm not, okay? That's one of the reasons. One of others, but his seeing that distinction when the Koran, which is seen as something dropped out of Heaven, which cannot be adapted or applied, even, and the Bible, which is a word of God that comes through a human community, it was stunning.
HH: And so, is it fair to describe him as a pessimist about the prospect of modernity truly engaging Islam in the way modernity has engaged Christianity?
JF: Well, the other way around.
HH: Yes. I meant that.
JF: Yeah, that Christianity can engage modernity just like it did...the Jews did Egypt, or Christians did to Greece, because we can take what's good there, and we can elevate it through the revelation of Christ in the Bible. But Islam is stuck. It's stuck with a text that cannot be adapted, or even be interpreted properly.
HH: And so the Pope is a pessimist about that changing, because it would require a radical reinterpretation of what the Koran is?
JF: Yeah, which is it's impossible, because it's against the very nature of the Koran, as it's understood by Muslims.
HH: And so, even the dialectic that was the Reformation is not possible within Islam?
JF: No. And then a second thing which he did not say, but which I would have said, I might have said at the time, is that...and this is from a Catholic point of view, there's no one to interpret the Koran officially. the Catholic Church has an official interpretor, which is the Holy Father with the bishops.
HH: Right. Well, let me ask you then. If, in fact, that reformation within Islam is not possible in the eyes of the Pope, and the demographics do not change, as they are unlikely to change in Europe, the last time Christendom went under the waves, so to speak, in Europe, there were the monasteries, beseiged as they were by the barbarians, sacked as they were by the Vikings, they endured.
JF: Yeah.
HH: That doesn't happen in modernity, because of the technology of oppression. And you've just noted the reluctance of Islam to accept religious pluralism, or to embrace it and celebrate it.
JF: Yes.
HH: And so what happens in Europe?
JF: Well, Hugh, I've got one of the very few things that I've said, which I'm proud of, because it's become kind of almost a slogan to some, is that home schools are the monasteries of the new dark ages. That is...and you non-Catholic Christians have a lot more of them than we Catholics do, but we've got a lot. And I think that is where families are having children. They're passing on the faith to their children. They're giving them wisdom and the knowledge of our culture. And we have an advantage here, because the homosexuals, and the pro-abortionists, and the pro-contraception people, are not having children by definition.
HH: That's in the Steyn article as well.
http://www.worldmusiccentral.org/artists/artist_page.php?id=1105
Biography:
A master of West African rhythms and credited as one of the founders of the Afro-pop genre, Salif Keita is world renowned for his unforgettable live performances, soaring vocals and his emotionally-fueled songs.
Born in Mali, West Africa in 1949, Salif Keita comes from a noble family, and is a descendant of Sunjata Keita, who founded the Mali Empire in 1240. Salif Keita was the third of thirteen children born to Sina Keita, a landowner in the village of Djoliba, where he grew up, near Mali’s capital, Bamako. Born albino in a land of blistering sun and heat, with limited eyesight and poor despite his social standing, his mother had to hide him to avoid the attacks of the superstitious crowds who called for his death. In addition to the problems of growing up as an albino, Keita found the opposition of his family to his interest in becoming a singer since the traditions of his ancestry excluded members of the nobility from becoming singers. Keita’s decision to become a musician broke an important taboo as in Mali only the lower jeli class makes its living from music.
In 1970, at the age of 18, Salif Keita left Djoliba for Bamako, where he spent time as a street musician and playing in bars. The first group that he worked with was the Super Rail Band, a state-sponsored ensemble that was based at a Bamako railway station hotel, and which has served as an important launching pad for the careers of numerous West African musicians, including kora player and singer Mory Kante, and guitarist Kante Manfila. The Rail Band became legendary because it nurtured Mory Kante and Salif Keita and also because it was one of the first to electrify Mandingo music and integrate Afro-Cuban influences which many West African instrumentalists brought back from their stay in Cuba.
In 1973, Salif Keita left the Rail Band, and with guitarist Kante Manfila he joined Les Ambassadeurs, which later became Les Ambassadeurs International. The new group developed the fusion between traditional music and western electric influences. 1977 saw Salif Keita being awarded the National Order of Guinea by Sekou Toure, the Guinean President. By that time, Salif Keita had also discovered American singers like Stevie Wonder, Ray Charles and Tina Turner. Their powerful way of singing and presence on stage taught Keita a lot about live performances.
Restricted by the limited opportunities and political climate in Mali, the group moved south and set up base in Abidjan in the Ivory Coast, where they performed and recorded successfully during the late 1970s. The epic 12 minute track "Mandjou", that is featured on the "Mansa of Mali" album, was recorded live in Abidjan during this period.
In 1984 Les Ambassadeurs Internationales broke up, and Salif Keita moved to Paris, launching a career that saw him recording the classic Soro album in 1987, produced by Ibrahim Sylla.
A recording deal with Island Records followed, which resulted in the release of the album Ko Yan in 1989, an album that nods to the Weather Report sound, and that led directly to Salif's collaboration with Weather Report keyboard man, composer and arranger Joe Zawinul in 1990. With help from Carlos Santana, Wayne Shorter and a number of carefully picked musicians from Mali and France, Zawinul produced Amen, the album that made Salif the first African band leader to win a Grammy nomination. The impressive Mansa of Mali retrospective was released in 1993 to coincide with Salif Keita’s tours of the United States, and Southern Africa. Recorded in Paris, New York and Bamako, his album, "Papa", features special guests Vernon Reid (Living Color), Grace Jones and John Medeski, an album of the new African/American music, bringing together musicians from Mali and America.
On his 2002 album, Moffou, Salif Keita is joined by excellent musicians, including Cape Verdian diva Cesaria Evora on the track Yamore, guitar-hero Djelly Moussa Kouyaté from Guinea, and the inescapable Kanté Manfila (acoustic guitar), both of them long-time companions of Salif. Additional musicians include Benoît Urbain on accordionthe harmonica, marimba and steel-drums of Arnaud Devosthe percussion of the ubiquitous Mino Cineluand the flutes of David Aubaile. On the traditional instrument side are the calabash, tom-toms, African congas and jembes of Mamadou Kone, Adama Kouyate, Souleyman Doumbia and Drissa Bakayokothe lutes of Jean-Louis Solans and Mehdi Haddad (Ekova)and the n’goni of Sayon Sissoko and Harouna Samake. The album was produced by Jean Lamoot.
Moffou is both the title of the album and the name of of the club that the singer opened in Bamako in 2002 to promote the West African music scene. In both cases, the choice of the name expresses his genuine desire to return to the roots of Mali.
In April of 2004, Decca/Universal Music released Remixes from Moffou. The album expands on the original recording of Moffou that took him on a tour around the world. He collaborated with some of the world’s finest producers and DJ’s, each bringing a unique contribution to the music, changing its tempo and atmosphere. A sound with a whole new dimension, the disc has traces of funk, house and drum-n-bass.Each song on Remixes is transformed - the songs were given a new face without distorting the delicate melodies that were originally written. The idea to remix the entire album was spawned from the feedback that was given from young music fans. They rushed out to buy “Yamore” (Keita’s duet with Cesaria Evora ) and club kids went crazy for Marin Solveig’s remix of “Madan.” European FM radio stations also took notice of the remix which prompted Universal France to take a step further.
Patrick Votan, artistic director at Universal Jazz France explains, “Following the success of “Madan” we decided to ask electro artists who are close to the African scene such as Osunlade, Doctor L and Frederic Galliano to work on remixes of other tracks from the album. We also got major mainstream electro stars such as La Funk Mob (the defunct duo of Cassius Philippe Zdar and Boombass who got back together for the project), Charles Webster and Luciano on board the project in the hope that this would take the work of Salif Keita, a unique and original artist, to the ears of a new public.”
Highlights from the disc include three different versions of favorites “Madan” and “Moussoulou.” Also featured is the slick mix of “Ana Na Ming” by La Funk Mob.
Discography:
Seydou Bathili (1982)
69-80 (Sonodisc)
Soro (Syllart, 1987)
Ko-Yan (Mango/Island, 1989)
Amen (Mango/Island, 1991)
L'enfant Lion (Mango/Island, 1992)
The Mansa Of Mali...A Retrospective (Mango/Island, 1994)
Folon... The Past (Mango/Island, 1994)
Papa (Metro Blue/Blue Note, 1999)
Moffou (Universal Music, 2002)
Remixes from Moffou (Decca/Universal Music, 2004)
Booking:
International Music Network(IMN). Address: 2 Main St., 4th Flr., Gloucester, MA 01930, USA. Phone: +1 (978) 283-2883, Fax: +1 (978) 283-2330. |
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