Harper government wimps out in free speech fight

[Rohan01]

This is sad.

There is no doubt now that Harper cares very little about core principles and only cares about short-term power.

Principles can only be put into action by those with power.

New tides have been known to rise before old one's crest.

Grig, I think we disagree with the definition of power. One who is correct has power, is the way I see it. Those who have more latitude because they took the oath of office, that looks to be the way you see it. For, I am speaking from my perspective.

[doggedlyright]

In the current circumstance their best move would be to appoint people to these HRC's that have a lick of common sense.

Grig;

Always the apologist for Harper and the CPC.

The above is great but the reality of action has been the appointing of more Liberals to the HRC as Harper has done in the last three appointments.

They were listed here (not this thread) for everyone to comment on.

Now we must be honest with ourselves. Harper and the CPC have purposely chosen to make the party sociallyu progressive. That is the fact of the matter.

Many complained on other threads that the people only elect left wing oriented parties. When that is only offerred up to the people, then do nto complain about them voting for the choices available.

The retaining of the HRC as constituted is another tool the progressives can use to halt the development of a conservative alternative to their progressive parties.

I understand this is not popular speak so to say but it has to be said over and over. Your choices today are liberal left and liberal socialism. Sad chocie for those that view themselves as conservative.

[littleharbour]

Harper has done a complete 180 on the free speech issue since his days as President of the NCC. Free speech is now his enemy. If the CHRC can suppress the views of those he considers to be abhorrent right wingers, then so much the better for him. I expect that the champagne corks would be popping in the PMO if FD ever bit the dust.

[Connie Fournier]

I'm tired of hearing Conservatives crowing one day about how they have the Liberals over a barrel and they can do whatever they want because the Liberals will do anything to avoid an election....and then turning around the next day and telling us that the Conservatives can't stand up for our most basic human right because they don't have a majority.

I'm tired of their crap, and they would do well to take a long look at what happened when we decided to "Vote conservative, Not Tory".

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[styky]

I would rather throw my vote to a party that I had a few problems with than vote for one of which I have absolutely nothing in common with.

The CPC and Harper still have my vote.

[doggedlyright]

I would rather throw my vote to a party that I had a few problems with than vote for one of which I have absolutely nothing in common with.

The CPC and Harper still have my vote.

styky;

let me be clear. I am not saying not to vote for Harper and the CPC. I am just making clear that you are voting for a very socially progressive party and not a conservative party.

Always remember what you are voting for. right now the CPC is moving to the left and the ignoring fundamental freedoms. based on this memo, they are on side with the HRC's and for expanding their roles. That is no different than the Liberals and the NDP. Sad but true.

[styky]

I would rather throw my vote to a party that I had a few problems with than vote for one of which I have absolutely nothing in common with.

The CPC and Harper still have my vote.

styky;

let me be clear. I am not saying not to vote for Harper and the CPC. I am just making clear that you are voting for a very socially progressive party and not a conservative party.

Always remember what you are voting for. right now the CPC is moving to the left and the ignoring fundamental freedoms. based on this memo, they are on side with the HRC's and for expanding their roles. That is no different than the Liberals and the NDP. Sad but true.

Which is about what I told them when they called and asked why I did not renew my membership or make a donation. I will vote for them but I will not support them with my wallet and they know why.

[Grig]

Grig, I think we disagree with the definition of power. One who is correct has power, is the way I see it. Those who have more latitude because they took the oath of office, that looks to be the way you see it. For, I am speaking from my perspective.

One who is correct has power to convince others perhaps, but being correct by itself doesn't give power to change laws or dismantle government bodies, if it did how did we wind up with SSM?

[Connie Fournier]

I would rather throw my vote to a party that I had a few problems with than vote for one of which I have absolutely nothing in common with.

The CPC and Harper still have my vote.

I could vote for the CHP and walk out with a clear conscience.

I want to work for the CPC candidate in my riding because I respect him immensely, but if Harper is going to gag his MPs on this issue, I will actively campaign against them.

If MPs are playing politics with our freedom, I don't really care if their ties are blue or red.

[Grig]

In the current circumstance their best move would be to appoint people to these HRC's that have a lick of common sense.

Grig;

Always the apologist for Harper and the CPC.

Look at it that way if you want, but you are not addressing the merits of what I said.

The above is great but the reality of action has been the appointing of more Liberals to the HRC as Harper has done in the last three appointments.

I don't know enough about the background of those three to comment, but if they are more of the same Harper blew a golden opportunity.

Many complained on other threads that the people only elect left wing oriented parties. When that is only offerred up to the people, then do nto complain about them voting for the choices available.

Canadians had a chance to vote for Reform, more than once. They didn't. They had a chance over and over to demonstrate where they lay politicaly and time and again it is with the left. Even when you have a Liberal party up to it's eyeballs in corruption, running a horrible campaign with a dithering leader the best the CPC could pull off was a small minority government. The Western Standard couldn't make a financial go of it either. Wake up, Canada is not ready to accept the kind of government you and I wish it had, nor is any such party or government going to last in the current culture.

Harper has done a great job of starting the move to the right in our culture. You are ready for it to go faster, but most others are not.

[Grig]

I'm tired of hearing Conservatives crowing one day about how they have the Liberals over a barrel and they can do whatever they want because the Liberals will do anything to avoid an election....and then turning around the next day and telling us that the Conservatives can't stand up for our most basic human right because they don't have a majority.

I'm tired of their crap, and they would do well to take a long look at what happened when we decided to "Vote conservative, Not Tory".

I don't recall every crowing about having the Liberals over a barrel and the CPC able to do whatever they want. There are some issues where the Liberals are neutered in their opposition, and that is because of widespread public support for what the government wants to do or internal conflicts. In areas where the Liberals won't suffer a backlash for opposing the government the CPC has to pick their battles with great care.

[tothechase]

I would rather throw my vote to a party that I had a few problems with than vote for one of which I have absolutely nothing in common with.

The CPC and Harper still have my vote.

I could vote for the CHP and walk out with a clear conscience.

I want to work for the CPC candidate in my riding because I respect him immensely, but if Harper is going to gag his MPs on this issue, I will actively campaign against them.

If MPs are playing politics with our freedom, I don't really care if their ties are blue or red.

Yes, I agree.
especially If i don't see a valid reason soon why the conservatives are avoiding this.

Harper has his challenges--I can appreciate that....but this issue is one I think is a net gain for Harper if he fixed it.

Does he think liberal fascist sentiment is that deeply entrenched in Canadian society that he can.t make this thing play?
or is he for this thought police stuff?

and what combination ?

He might be looking at how to play this and doesn't,t want any MP's saying things that might help future traps set out by CBC and the libs.

if so-cons and Christians cannot get representation--and this is a defining issue--there is the CHP to turn to .

and consequence of splitting the vote is understood---

this will be the catalyst for Christians to get into a block and get representation for there taxes and rightfull place in society.

[fourhorses]

Simple enough to answer:

If we hand the CPC a majority and Freedom of Speech is something they are not willing to defend, then we, as citizens, have relinquished our rights.

What we need is an indication from the CPC that they WILL DEFEND this. They may not want to make this a prime electoral issue, however, come out and confirm it in a much more definitive manner than an off-the-cuff remark from Jason Kenny. Otherwise, kiss a lot of votes, legwork and monetary support goodbye.

[Adonick]

I would rather throw my vote to a party that I had a few problems with than vote for one of which I have absolutely nothing in common with.

The CPC and Harper still have my vote.

styky;

let me be clear. I am not saying not to vote for Harper and the CPC. I am just making clear that you are voting for a very socially progressive party and not a conservative party.

Always remember what you are voting for. right now the CPC is moving to the left and the ignoring fundamental freedoms. based on this memo, they are on side with the HRC's and for expanding their roles. That is no different than the Liberals and the NDP. Sad but true.

Socially progressive as in allowing the DEA to set up shop in Vancouver?

Socially progressive as in stifling free speech and propping up CHRC's?

Give me a break. Harper is acting like Bush's towelboy on one hand and kissing the ethnic/racial identity vote square on the ass at the same time.

I want a leader who will stand up for the rights of all individuals to have access to the basic necessities of life, to education and gainful employment, to live in peace in their own homes, with the freedoms to do as they wish, in a sovereign state.

I don't want a Government that is essentially a shill for what has become a fascistic interpretation of conservatism (contemporary GOP) - while simultaneously pandering to the social fascists/hypocrites that fly the multicoloured banner that symbolizes an endless train of special interest lobbies.